Game improvement irons

Haha... I saw that thread too but I'm not keen on selling the 300s just yet. If anything, I'll maintain 2 sets (one for SG and the other for JB). Very troublesome to carry clubs back and forth since my son has a lot of stuff which fills up the car boot v quickly.

Anyway, did you say break 80? I've broken 80 many times. Usually after 12 holes or so.

zhenxua wrote:

GI has bigger "sweet spot" ie ball will still fly if you mishit slightly, and SGI has even bigger "sweet spot"

however, if you can consistently hit the sweet spot on a player's iron, you will experience loss of distance in the GI and SGI

Why the loss of distance in the GI and SGI when you consistently hit sweet spot?

I think ZX meant that one will experience a loss of distance when:

- hitting the sweet spot on a player's iron

vs

- hitting a GI/SGI club

If not, then I'm confused too.

pushslice wrote:

bro Gfool, want my TP Forged? If you dont mind the dings on PW's sole. Can offer super friendly friendly price for my Lo Hei teammate. I'm still waiting for your Cally Diablo wood lor...when when?

I'm damn keen bro....wanted to try my own irons at OCC yesterday to see how I'd fare but playing Aranda / Vanda from the blue tee, it was driver, FW/H, wedge the whole damn time...i probably used my iron (not counting wedge) on an approach shot only 4 times.....a bloody miserable day....only had 3 GIR...maybe see u again at SSN this week?

I may miss this week SSN, coz wife out of town..kidsitting duty.

But as I said, you can take my TM bag for the next two weeks to try in your games. See if you like 'em. Bcoz I'm not playing till Ghoonk comes in February. I can take bag in the boot, car parked nearby MoM. Anytime bro...

I just bought a new set (and another Cally set coming from Ghoonk) so if you dun want this TM set, I will ship it to Jakarta, probably left to rust

Ssquirrel wrote:

zhenxua wrote:

GI has bigger "sweet spot" ie ball will still fly if you mishit slightly, and SGI has even bigger "sweet spot"

however, if you can consistently hit the sweet spot on a player's iron, you will experience loss of distance in the GI and SGI

Why the loss of distance in the GI and SGI when you consistently hit sweet spot?

grandmaster, i'm not sure too.

e.g. i can hit the same iron further with AP2 than AP1 even though the AP1 is supposedly "stronger", but i noticed that the AP1 ball flight is much higher which could have resulted in the loss of distance.

You will probably hit the AP1's higher because they have more offset and a lower C of G than AP2's[quote] Both of these will lead to higher ball flight.

ZX, the AP1s have more game improvement to help get the ball up like GooGie mentioned. You already launch the ball so high with your irons, the AP1s just make you balloon the ball what, ergo, loss of distance lor.

Oh dear... No one has used the word "ergo" since Julius Caesar rocked the house.

editor must have the editor say...

so u just made me wanna rewatch matrix

zhenxua wrote:

Ssquirrel wrote:

zhenxua wrote:

GI has bigger "sweet spot" ie ball will still fly if you mishit slightly, and SGI has even bigger "sweet spot"

however, if you can consistently hit the sweet spot on a player's iron, you will experience loss of distance in the GI and SGI

Why the loss of distance in the GI and SGI when you consistently hit sweet spot?

grandmaster, i'm not sure too.

e.g. i can hit the same iron further with AP2 than AP1 even though the AP1 is supposedly "stronger", but i noticed that the AP1 ball flight is much higher which could have resulted in the loss of distance.

U really need to compare apple to apple when you are compaing irons, i.e, same shaft, same ball, same conditions. And not a one off case. Because in this case, we are talking about GI irons. So with the same confirgurations, you should be able to tell the difference.

But seriously, why is there a thinking that high ball flight result in shorter distance? So far, i have yet to see a long hitters with low ball flights. Long toppers, i have seen alot....

duffader wrote:

But seriously, why is there a thinking that high ball flight result in shorter distance?

Wouldn't high ball flight mean greater elevation but a loss of distance since the ball travels upwards more than it does forward. I'm making this assumption on an apples-to-apples comparison, i.e. same golfer, same club, same stroke, same strength.

Then why pros take a longer club to hit a knock down shot or a punch shot?

I always have the luxury of admiring Tim's iron play at the range. His 5 iron ball flight is like my 5 wood ball flight. Hence it has more air time hence the ball travel more up in the air allowing it to have more air time and then landing with a carry of about 190m-200m. If its lower, then the ball will come down faster and of course with roll, but if its on most fairway, i doubt it will roll any further.. and for iron play, who would want those roll.....

duffader wrote:

Then why pros take a longer club to hit a knock down shot or a punch shot?

I always have the luxury of admiring Tim's iron play at the range. His 5 iron ball flight is like my 5 wood ball flight. Hence it has more air time hence the ball travel more up in the air allowing it to have more air time and then landing with a carry of about 190m-200m. If its lower, then the ball will come down faster and of course with roll, but if its on most fairway, i doubt it will roll any further.. and for iron play, who would want those roll.....

WMF likes this.

Benny - you think this is facebook, ah?

I am refraining long comments for my opponents prior to Lo Hei games.

Technospaz wrote:

I read that with game improvement irons, the ball launch angle is slightly higher vs player irons. To my newbie mind, this means that a ball gets better elevation but would also lose distance. Is that correct?

TS

Bro, GI irons launch higher cos you know most of us need help getting the ball up. Those who use player irons already have a high enough launch, and most of them seek a more penetrating ball flight which is more predictable in windy conditions.

With GI irons a higher launch angle doesn't mean a loss of distance, in fact, quite the opposite. Take for example the best selling TM Burner irons which have always touted distance as its strong point. It's a game improvement iron too.

Distance in a game improvement iron comes from stronger lofts, as in a PW of 45deg versus the more traditional lofts in a player's PW of 48 deg.

To keep it simple, a higher launch angle is achieved with a lower CG, possible because of the multi-material use in the iron clubheads these days. The other contributing factor is the the shaft which could be of a higher torque with a low kick point.

To clarify, there are also differences between a GI and SGI iron.

Game improvement irons we are all familiar with, like the MX300, X24, and AP1s.

Super game improvement irons have characteristics like even wider soles than GI irons (almost hybrid like), whippier shafts, extremely low CG, increased offset, and sets tend to have hybrids replace the long to mid irons for exceptionally easy and higher launch.

eiji wrote:

editor must have the editor say...

so u just made me wanna rewatch matrix

I just did!

duffader wrote:

zhenxua wrote:

Ssquirrel wrote:

zhenxua wrote:

GI has bigger "sweet spot" ie ball will still fly if you mishit slightly, and SGI has even bigger "sweet spot"

however, if you can consistently hit the sweet spot on a player's iron, you will experience loss of distance in the GI and SGI

Why the loss of distance in the GI and SGI when you consistently hit sweet spot?

grandmaster, i'm not sure too.

e.g. i can hit the same iron further with AP2 than AP1 even though the AP1 is supposedly "stronger", but i noticed that the AP1 ball flight is much higher which could have resulted in the loss of distance.

U really need to compare apple to apple when you are compaing irons, i.e, same shaft, same ball, same conditions. And not a one off case. Because in this case, we are talking about GI irons. So with the same confirgurations, you should be able to tell the difference.

But seriously, why is there a thinking that high ball flight result in shorter distance? So far, i have yet to see a long hitters with low ball flights. Long toppers, i have seen alot....

I played the AP1 for a year before switching to AP2, and my irons are usually 95% carry with 5% roll for both irons

I personally think that the AP1 ball flight is higher than optimum thus resulting in loss of distance, for me that is

Birdman wrote:

Technospaz wrote:

I read that with game improvement irons, the ball launch angle is slightly higher vs player irons. To my newbie mind, this means that a ball gets better elevation but would also lose distance. Is that correct?

TS

Bro, GI irons launch higher cos you know most of us need help getting the ball up. Those who use player irons already have a high enough launch, and most of them seek a more penetrating ball flight which is more predictable in windy conditions.

With GI irons a higher launch angle doesn't mean a loss of distance, in fact, quite the opposite. Take for example the best selling TM Burner irons which have always touted distance as its strong point. It's a game improvement iron too.

Distance in a game improvement iron comes from stronger lofts, as in a PW of 45deg versus the more traditional lofts in a player's PW of 48 deg.

To keep it simple, a higher launch angle is achieved with a lower CG, possible because of the multi-material use in the iron clubheads these days. The other contributing factor is the the shaft which could be of a higher torque with a low kick point.

To clarify, there are also differences between a GI and SGI iron.

Game improvement irons we are all familiar with, like the MX300, X24, and AP1s.

Super game improvement irons have characteristics like even wider soles than GI irons (almost hybrid like), whippier shafts, extremely low CG, increased offset, and sets tend to have hybrids replace the long to mid irons for exceptionally easy and higher launch.

Very good feedback ergo I'm enlightened

TS

Just read this thread.

There's nothing wrong with your irons. They are built for high-mid cappers.

I can hand a total beginner an SGI and he will still whiff the ball.

As long as you put some quality practice into the game, they will serve u well.

I played with my buddy's TM 300s with shafts too long n grips too big last week in US and I did tons better than my last game of 2010. It shows that when u dun think of equipment too much and just focus on getting decent contact, your game will be alot better.

As for why I ho w equipment so much, thats just cos its my vice and I'm loving it. Nothing to do with trying to get a better game cos I've pretty much maxed out my potential.

This is a good vice to have.

S70B wrote:

TS

Just read this thread.

There's nothing wrong with your irons. They are built for high-mid cappers.

I can hand a total beginner an SGI and he will still whiff the ball.

As long as you put some quality practice into the game, they will serve u well.

I played with my buddy's TM 300s with shafts too long n grips too big last week in US and I did tons better than my last game of 2010. It shows that when u dun think of equipment too much and just focus on getting decent contact, your game will be alot better.

As for why I ho w equipment so much, thats just cos its my vice and I'm loving it. Nothing to do with trying to get a better game cos I've pretty much maxed out my potential.

Thanks, bro. I appreciate the feedback. I believe that practice is key (and along with it, coaching). I'm hoping to get some of that done this year. But at the same time, I feel that the equipment one uses plays an important role. I'm not suggesting that one can only play well with a select type of clubs, but certainly, the more forgiving clubs tend to aid the player.

From my perspective, I fear that I've maxed out my potential too. I've settled to being a mediocre player and have accepted that I will duff my shots, I will top the ball, I will play table-tennis with greenside bunkers, I will send balls into the jungle, water and other golfers and I will spend more time looking for my ball than hitting it.

That said, I also believe that if I'm going to go through that sort of "pain," I'd like to do so with clubs which are a little more forgiving so I can minimize the blunders. The MX-300s are great clubs but I feel that they are meant more for mid-handicappers than they are for high-handicappers. They are a good blend between blades and GIs, and will require some skill to master them.

I've picked up a set of MX-200s which I'll use in combination with the MX-300s. I'm not saying that my game will improve. What I am hoping for, however, is that I won't feel as frustrated after each game.

I may still take 5 shots to get to the green on a Par 4 but at least, the shots will be (hopefully) more on the fairway than in the rough.

you have picked up? fast hand fast leg, I like!