Lost ball - stroke and distance, or 2 strokes?

I know officially if you've lost your ball, you take a one stroke penalty, and have to play another ball from the last played position - hence the stroke and distance penalty.

In my casual games, we usually search for the ball first, and if it's really lost, a ball is dropped where the last one roughly landed, and take a 2 stroke penalty. Of course this saves time since we don't have to go all the way back to where the last ball was hit. I've been searching the net for this rule, and i can't seem to find it anywhere.. have we been cheating ourselves all this while? Or is there some provision to the lost ball rule which i just can't find?

Bro, that's what I've been told and what I've been doing. I'm sure there's a rule about this (and I may be wrong too) but I'm happy to know that I'm not the only one with this approach to lost balls.

You are always suppose to hit a provisional if you suspect that ur ball is lost. There is no rule on dropping and adding 2 strokes.

Sometimes, its done because its oni a social round and failure to hit a p ball means having to walk all the way back to where u last hit a shot. Not very practical if there is already bunching up of flights and golfers behind alr.

Out of curiosity, S70B, what happens if your provisional ball also goes wayward and you think that it too may be lost? Does this mean you take a 2nd provisional ball?

Do it till its right. Thats how some people rack up huge scores esp in club medals. Its also why its very common to have 5h+ rounds esp when the format of play is strokeplay.

Helps to carry more than 1 extra ball in the pocket.

Understood. Thanks, bro!

And what you may not be aware is.... if you find your orginal ball the provisonal no longer exsists....

So if you find ball 1 and it is in a terrible place, you cannot elect to play the provisional, once you find the first one it is still the ball in play....

You can however elect not to even look for ball 1 if you think it is in a bad spot.....

That was what I was told too, SH. I think some people don't realize that and elect to play what they believe is the better lying ball which isn't correct.

Technospaz wrote:

That was what I was told too, SH. I think some people don't realize that and elect to play what they believe is the better lying ball which isn't correct.

A lot easier, but not correct...

shorthitter wrote:

Technospaz wrote:

That was what I was told too, SH. I think some people don't realize that and elect to play what they believe is the better lying ball which isn't correct.

A lot easier, but not correct...

One of those situations where it depends on your flightmates. If your flightmates are happy to disregard the rules, then it's your advantage. However, it doesn't make you a better golfer. If you're going to play, play right. (A lot easier said than done though)

If the 2nd ball is beautifully in the middle of fairway, you can 'help' your opponent find his ball that is in terrible lie.

There is a rule that says "you cannot agree to disregard the rules" not in those words but you get the idea... you either want to play golf or you dont....

Can you imagine a Mahjong game where at the beginning you say.. " no rules today"...

sunny wrote:

If the 2nd ball is beautifully in the middle of fairway, you can 'help' your opponent find his ball that is in terrible lie.

This raises a good question. As SH said, the golfer can elect not to look for his first ball BUT, can the opponent insist and what happens if the opponent does find the first ball (whether through insistence or by accident)?

hi,
From what i understand(correct me if i'm wrong, If your ball is lost into a hazard marked by red stake then you get one stroke penalty and to take a short closest to the point where you lost the ball. If your ball enter and area that is marked by white line and stakes then you are penalize 2 stroke and to retake the shot closest to the spot where you last hit.

lt

sunny wrote:

If the 2nd ball is beautifully in the middle of fairway, you can 'help' your opponent find his ball that is in terrible lie.

You can, but it is his choice, "dont look I declare it lost "is his call, the same as the only person that can decide if a ball is unplayable is the player, not an opponent....

shorthitter wrote:

sunny wrote:

If the 2nd ball is beautifully in the middle of fairway, you can 'help' your opponent find his ball that is in terrible lie.

You can, but it is his choice, "dont look I declare it lost "is his call, the same as the only person that can decide if a ball is unplayable is the player, not an opponent....

Thanks, SH. That clears things up.

ngekngek wrote:

hi,
From what i understand(correct me if i'm wrong, If your ball is lost into a hazard marked by red stake then you get one stroke penalty and to take a short closest to the point where you lost the ball. If your ball enter and area that is marked by white line and stakes then you are penalize 2 stroke and to retake the shot closest to the spot where you last hit.

lt

Yes almost correct, the first is closet to the " point of entry" into the hazard. The second is not 2 strokes, it is what they call stroke and distance, which means you have to go back to where you last hit from... drop the ball (1 stroke) then hit again.....

Technospaz wrote:

shorthitter wrote:

sunny wrote:

If the 2nd ball is beautifully in the middle of fairway, you can 'help' your opponent find his ball that is in terrible lie.

You can, but it is his choice, "dont look I declare it lost "is his call, the same as the only person that can decide if a ball is unplayable is the player, not an opponent....

Thanks, SH. That clears things up.

but what if you found the ball even if he declare it lost? I thought if it is a p ball, you still got to play it if it is in play. Only if you are hitting it as a 3rd shot rather than p ball then your opponents cannot help you find.

Technospaz wrote:

sunny wrote:

If the 2nd ball is beautifully in the middle of fairway, you can 'help' your opponent find his ball that is in terrible lie.

This raises a good question. As SH said, the golfer can elect not to look for his first ball BUT, can the opponent insist and what happens if the opponent does find the first ball (whether through insistence or by accident)?

see my above post. If you choose to play a third shot, your opponent cannot help you look. If you play a p ball, if it is found to be in play, your p ball cease to exist.

That is why you have to state if you are playing p ball if you re tee

If I declare it is lost.. game over. I can walk straight to my Provisonal and keep playing.

The other little known one, is that I can hit my provisional more than once, till I get to my first ball, and then abandon provisional and play the original....

getting confusing?????

Say on a short par 4, you hit a ball into deep rough and may be lost. You play a p ball, hit it short this time to keep it in play. Approach perfectly to within a foot or two to make a simple bogey. According to you, you can declare the first ball lost. But what if when your opponent goes up and found the ball sitting deep behind trees and insist your p ball cease to be in play cos original is found?

He got a gd point. P ball cannot be an insurance shot.

Well this is why the commentators on tv say the rules can work for you as well as against you....

• c. Ball Not Found Within Five Minutes
If a ball is lost as a result of not being found or identified as his by the player within five minutes after the player's side or his or their caddies have begun to search for it, the player must play a ball, under penalty of one stroke, as nearly as possible at the spot from which the original ball was last played (see Rule 20-5).

The key words here are identified by the player, you being my opponentt may find it but if I dont want to no about it, tough for you...

If it was a short par 4 then i would want you to find it, i am sure I could get it around the green and chip up and save par, I dont need to make bogey no matter how easy it is....

Haha. I'll take a easy bogey anyday

sunny wrote:

Haha. I'll take a easy bogey anyday

Big girls blouse... birdies rule!!!!!

S70B wrote:

You are always suppose to hit a provisional if you suspect that ur ball is lost. There is no rule on dropping and adding 2 strokes.

Sometimes, its done because its oni a social round and failure to hit a p ball means having to walk all the way back to where u last hit a shot. Not very practical if there is already bunching up of flights and golfers behind alr.

Agree on hitting a p-ball whenever suspect lost ball.. but i'm talking more like i hit the ball centre of fairway, and bloody sure it was there but just can't seem to find it.

So let's clear this up once and for all. There's no ruling that allows you to drop where your ball was "likely" to be, and take a 2 stroke penalty; and only the stroke and distance penalty applies to a lost ball.

Even if you decide to use the 2 stroke penalty in a social game, just remember it's not an official ruling!

Thanks for the quick answers from the experts here