Dynamic vs Static Club Fitting

Case Study:

The student: 148cm tall and has a decent swing speed. Her wrist to ground measurement does not register on the fitting charts. Can handle more than a junior or ladies flex club. Her hands are very small.
Constant battle with getting her swing and impact right
She has been to a club fitter on numerous occasions and tried many combinations of clubs but to no avail.

The Clubs: She has Mens Tour Stage irons and was fitted with NS Pro Reg shaft. The 7 iron length is 36.5. She has been given a mens standard size grip and lie angles (I think) are standard

Fitted on a trackman and tape on sole of club for lie angle.

The problem: She has been fitted to her current impact dynamically which is incorrect impact. This does not allow her to set up in the correct posture and angles therefore her swing can never be corrected

Solution: With the help of a club fitter, we built a club that allows her to set up correctly which now means she can improve her impact and ball striking

Conclusion: In my opinion, only get fitted dynamically once you have a swing that is repeatable and you can achieve correct impact. Go with your pro to the clubfitter and work together to achieve the desired outcomes.
You may find your swing problems are a result of your clubs

I guess it is a "what comes first, the chicken or the egg?"

I like to give a student a club that fits their desired impact and make them use that rather than a club that suits their undesired impact and ingrains bad faults.

This video shows how my theory worked in this case



The swing was changed in 10 balls after having this on going problem for over a year going down the dynamic route.

I think the trackman is great for working out shaft flex particularly with drivers and it does give great data but in this case, the static fit was the better option. I guess it's a case by case basis

I am not a club fitter but I know by looking at a student whether or not their club length, grip size and lie angle will work. As for shaft flexes, swing weights, shaft and head weights and building the club, that's were I need the help from a professional fitter. It's a Team effort and a holistic approach

It really helps when a pro knows about club fitting. Really help alot when the pro goes with the student for thefitting session. So at least the pro can inform the fitter what he should achieve for the student.

I have heard about pros getting a cut from the spendings of the student at the fitter. To me, this is so unprofessional. Some of them even ask for it. But knowing paul's commitment to his students, I think the student is damn lucky. So for those looking for a coach, this is one factor you should consider too.

Hi Paul, does it means if a golfer's swing is repeatable but yet can progress further should consider visiting club fitter?

Does it also means stock specification of off the shelve club can cause our body to adjust our swing to suit stock spec?

Cos I had recently realize that at address, my toe of club seems to be higher than the heel... will this affect my swing? If yes, what is the possible affected result?

jtek wrote:

Hi Paul, does it means if a golfer's swing is repeatable but yet can progress further should consider visiting club fitter?

Does it also means stock specification of off the shelve club can cause our body to adjust our swing to suit stock spec?

Cos I had recently realize that at address, my toe of club seems to be higher than the heel... will this affect my swing? If yes, what is the possible affected result?

It could be the case jtek.
I know your swing as I gave u a lesson many months ago but not sure of its current status.

I would say that if it is sitting toe up at address, then you will have to change your club at impact to make it contact the ground flush. In this case you would have to raise your hands and body higher than they were at address otherwise the heel of the club is going to dig into the ground and shut the club. If you rasie the hands, you may also miss the ball right as the face can open

In the RSS, we try to keep set up and impact similar. Not sure if you are still swinging this way. Generally RSS players will have a neutral lie angle, even slightly flat. The length of the club can also affect this.

Best to check your set up. If your angles are good and the toes still sits up, then you may need to make some adjustments

Hi Paul, thanks for remembering me..

Yes, I'm swing right side... set up as per impact... but dunno why find my toe up at set up.

And u were right, I am finding myself raising my hands and body higher recently... I am gripping my club 1.5 inch away from end of grip... should I lower my grip? Or set up my balls nearer to body?

So what does it mean by slightly flat? Flat at set up? Flat means club lean forward like we were taught in RSS?

Sorry to ask so much...

duffader wrote:

I have heard about pros getting a cut from the spendings of the student at the fitter. To me, this is so unprofessional. Some of them even ask for it.

Generally the fitter and pro will have an arrangement where they both send each other clients, i.e the student swing has faults that need to be fixed before fitting can occur so the fitter recommends a pro to make swing more stable. Pro makes income off the referral

If pro is sending clients to fitter but fitter not sending clients to pro or vice versa, then here a cut may be warranted. It happens in every business were agents, managers etc have this arrangement. Hotels, airfares etc are examples of this when booked through a 3rd party

I have spent many hours at the fitters with students and do this FOC as it makes my job easier once the club is correct. Also saves the student time and money with unnecessary work being done.

jtek wrote:

Hi Paul, thanks for remembering me..

Yes, I'm swing right side... set up as per impact... but dunno why find my toe up at set up.

And u were right, I am finding myself raising my hands and body higher recently... I am gripping my club 1.5 inch away from end of grip... should I lower my grip? Or set up my balls nearer to body?

So what does it mean by slightly flat? Flat at set up? Flat means club lean forward like we were taught in RSS?

Sorry to ask so much...

Without seeing your set up I cant comment.

By slightly flat I mean the lie angle of the club. Sounds like yours may be too upright

Right_sided_coach wrote:

duffader wrote:

I have heard about pros getting a cut from the spendings of the student at the fitter. To me, this is so unprofessional. Some of them even ask for it.

Generally the fitter and pro will have an arrangement where they both send each other clients, i.e the student swing has faults that need to be fixed before fitting can occur so the fitter recommends a pro to make swing more stable. Pro makes income over the referral

If pro is sending clients to fitter but fitter not sending clients to pro or vice versa, then here a cut may be warranted. It happens in every business were agents, managers etc have this arrangement. Hotels, airfares etc are examples of this when booked through a 3rd party

I have spent many hours at the fitters with students and do this FOC as it makes my job easier once the club is correct. Also saves the student time and money with unnecessary work being done.

Well, i guess the fitter can't tell his customer that the club that he has just fitted will only worked if he goes to a certain pro right? And most of the guys that are constantly getting fitted are already of a certain standard. Just want to get fitted for an easier time on the golf course. Imagine a guy who use to use X100 shafts when he was in his 30s, but he refuse to change the heads of the clubs as he is super used to it. So they go to a fitter, and find a more suitable set of shafts to change it.

Like what you say paul, it will make your job easier if your students are properly fitted. Which means, certain objectives that you set out to achieve with that student will be achieve in an shorter time rather than spending hours over the same thing. So its still savings for you in a way or another, although not monetary.

I think one way for a pro to have more students in giving free advice every now and then. Seriously, looking at alot of golers at the range, i think around 60-70% of them needs help, but the biggest goal of the pro, is to convince them to get lessons rather than spending on new equipment.

I just feel that if a student comes to know that his pro is bringing them to a fitter, knowing that he will get a cut from the spendings might become wary of his coach. Cos he will be wondering, if my coach need that little commission, then he might trying to delay my learning span so that i will have to put more hours with him. Children or parents who do not understand the life of a teaching pro, might think otherwise and hence change coach or refuse to allow the equipment change.

Anyway, the above are just my opinions.

duffader wrote:

I think one way for a pro to have more students in giving free advice every now and then. Seriously, looking at alot of golers at the range, i think around 60-70% of them needs help, but the biggest goal of the pro, is to convince them to get lessons rather than spending on new equipment.

Like +1

Right_sided_coach wrote:

jtek wrote:

Hi Paul, thanks for remembering me..

Yes, I'm swing right side... set up as per impact... but dunno why find my toe up at set up.

And u were right, I am finding myself raising my hands and body higher recently... I am gripping my club 1.5 inch away from end of grip... should I lower my grip? Or set up my balls nearer to body?

So what does it mean by slightly flat? Flat at set up? Flat means club lean forward like we were taught in RSS?

Sorry to ask so much...

Without seeing your set up I cant comment.

By slightly flat I mean the lie angle of the club. Sounds like yours may be too upright

Thanks paul! Mmmm maybe its time to go back to school...

i'm a student of Paul for the past year and my swing had changed dramatically in this time. Paul was kind enough to accompany me to BFG to custom fit my irons and putter together with Eric. In fact, Paul had a look at my putter length during my first putting lesson and refused to coach me then and immediately ask me to contact BFG to lengthen it.

I think that is very important as a coach will know your setup and especially for RSS, the clubs setup is different from the traditional left sided swing and I am very appreciative of what Paul has done for me, outside of our lesson time. At least this part of it remove my worries of the club not suiting me and allow me to focus on my technique and swing. Now I got no more excuse

BTW, I am 1.88m tall and weigh 100kg (Imagine my size)